Holy cow. I do that incessantly. And I’m always annoyed by my mathematic results.

It only gets worse, ladies. As of June, I’ll be starting that “game” with the number 3-5. Now that’s just nuts. And btw, not really such a fun game.

Yep, except I’m starting with 32!

Jesus christ, I’m married and I still do that. Why can’t I wait six years to have babies like my parents did? I feel terribly pressured.

Anyway, a coworker of mine is 36, met a 35 year old after years of J-Dating on JDate this past September. They were engaged in December, getting married next month, and are already house shopping so they can start a family. My head spins at the thought of all this, but it shows, that when you meet someone and you want the same things, it doesn’t have to take years to get it started.

Too bad I want years.

I play it too. I never really wanted to get married and have kids before and now that I think it might be a good idea, my results? I am never getting married and having kids.

I figure, I’m 33 soon to be 34. I’d want to know the man at least 2 years before getting married *36* and be married at least 2 years before getting PG *38* … and who knows when I’ll meet someone with that kind of potential (read: someone I would be willing to be tied to for the rest of my life) so add however long that will be to 36 and 38 = *3? and 4?*

Yep. I figure I’ll be at least 40 before all this could happen and then I’d almost be too old to have kids …

Not a fun game indeed.

i sorta do that too. but more like “whats the latest i can meet mr. right, get engagded, get married, have kids, etc…” in an ideal world, they can all be spaced out with a coupla years in between, but when i’m hitting the next age group this year (the one that begins with 3,) i sorta feel that might not be reality…

ladies:
it may not be a fun game…but, remember, never lose sight of the dream. It can easily become a reality…it only takes one!! The right guy is there, keep looking in all the right places. (that is a song lyric with the word wrong instead of right, isn’t it?) anyway, never let go of the dream, which is what it is, it is not a fantasy. Dreams DO come true. your b’shert is right around the corner!!!

Love,

mom

Hil’s Mom, you’re making *me* feel better and I’m not even your daughter. Hilary, I play that game, too. But remember, it really does only take one, even if it takes that “one” a freakin’ long time to find you. And I have a friend who’s 42 or 43 and she’s pregnant with her second child. She’s a single mother by choice, because she really wanted to have children and hasn’t found the right guy yet. It’s not what she planned on a decade ago, I’m sure, but she *is* happy with her reality now.

My mom’s comment is brought to you by Mom, President and Founder, of Dreams Do Come True: Your soulmate is out there.

definitely do it. i think we are programmed to do it… It’s just important to remember that it’s just as important to have a child with the right man as it is to have a child.. conundrum…

Another game I like to play is “how much has life in changed in (X time)” and then realize how drastically things can change over even short spans like days/weeks/months. Compare yourself now to where you were 6 months ago, or 1 year ago, and think how much different things can be 6 months from now…I’m sounding very Pollyanna now, aren’t I.

I used to do that alot. You aren’t alone.

My younger pregnant sister is in the announcing stage and I can’t say enough how I hate being around when she is announcing to someone. I don’t want to sound like the mean big sister but it just brings up the topic of when I am going to do the same; while reminding me that I’m not interested in having kids anytime soon or that I even may not want to have any children of my own.
I am just happy thinking I get to be the cool Aunt…

A good friend turned 30, received her Ph.D., met a man on JDate, got engaged, married, and pregnant, all within 6 months. There is something to be said for being efficient, but there’s also something to be said for taking time to enjoy things along the way…

Try doing that when you’re turning 40 this year.

I feel compelled to post again: Judging by the posts here it seems that the only way to meet people is on Jdate…are there not alternatives?

My mom, who at 29 was considered a spinster by many (this was the ’60s, you know), met my dad after she donned false eyelashes for the first and last time in her life and boldly winked at him at a poetry reading at some coffee bar in San Francisco. They moved in together a few weeks (!) later and were married in less than three months. They’ll have been married for 39 years this November. Life doesn’t always follow the most obvious path…

Hmmm.. not too many posts by guys, eh? I guess it’s the somber topic. It’s odd, as a guy, to think about this issue. In theory, we don’t have to worry about it b/c barring some physical problem, we can have kids well into our 50’s. But I think about it a lot. I’m 34 and ideally want to find a life partner who’s life experience I can relate to, which probably means someone close to my age. So that means as I get older, so does she. I also don’t relish the idea of watching my kid go to college when I’m in my 60’s. So in some ways, I feel an indirect pressure to have kids soon — not for biological reasons, but for life-compatibility reasons.

Anyway, I know it’s nothing equivalent to what women feel confronting this issue, but we guys aren’t totally immune.

Meg:
What a delightful story. Congrats on your folks being married 39 years. Hil’s dad and I are going to celebrate 37 this June. You girls will be celebrating many years with your hubbies soon too.

Love,

MOM
President and Founder, of Dreams Do Come True: Your soulmate is out there.

Jason:

How tall are you?? Do you live in LA? Have you met Hilary???

HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM……………….

MOM

Here we go again. Mom, you’re not allowed to pimp me out on my blog, remember?

MOM: I’m 5′8″ and from SF, so probably not an ideal candidate, but I do plan to take Hilary out for a drink next time I’m in town and tease her about her Internet Celebrity status.

For the record–I do date men shorter than myself and I do look forward to having a drink with Jason while I bask in the glory of my celebrity-ness.

Reading this I was thinking of Wendy Wasserstein, the brilliant playwright who died last week at 55. She had her only child Lucy Jane at 48, after 8 years of trying. Strangely Jewlicious does not have her obit but it’s here: [http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/theater/AP-Obit-Wasserstein.html?_r=1&oref=slogin]
And the Wikipedia entry on her is here: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wendy_Wasserstein]

I mention this because many of her plays dealt so honestly about this issue, particularly the ‘Heidi Chronicles’ & ‘The Sisters Rosensweig’, but she’s right there with you all in spirit. I’d recommend any of them very highly.

It can be awfully depressing when considering just the numbers and the relentless facts of aging, and yes this does affect the guys too. Sperm ages markedly after 40, taking a qualitative nosedive after 50 or so. So even with advancing technology, many women & couples will find that it is still fairly difficult and expensive to give birth to a child much after age 38-40. It can be done, but it frequently costs the equivalent of a 2nd mortgage if you’re driven to using IVF for other assisted technologies.

It’s serious stuff no doubt which is why AL’s friend & the great Wendy Wasserstein chose to become single moms. Increasingly it’s an option that more women are considering. (The inside betting is that one of Wendy’s long time friends/’gay husbands’ may have fathered Jane).

But this is also a numbers game, and it should remind us too that life is truly short sometimes. You are truly blessed if you have your parents still with you. Both mine were gone by the time I was 34, my mother not being much older than Wasserstein when she went.

Cheers & Good Luck, ‘VJ’, ga.

you don’t need a man to have a kid if that is what you really really want.

As Meg said above, not eveyone follows the same socially-prescribed path (forgive my pedantic tone–I’m an anthropologist). Socially, we are expected to do certain things at certain times, like go to college, get our own places, get married, and have kids in that order, and we feel the pressure (socially and biologically). I guess the point I’m trying to make is that when we see that some of these social expectations are just that, social, we can release some of the pressure off ourselves to achieve certain life goals by a certain time. (I can’t address the biological issue–not my field of expertise!)

Elise is right, you don’t need a man to have a kid. And having a man doesn’t make having the kid any easier either, when career issues arise. When you get married in your early 30s (which always struck me as about right, on the maturity scale), the perfect time to have kids also happens to be the time when you should be focusing on your work, if a successful career is also a goal. How much longer can I put off having kids for the sake of the job I love, before I miss my chance? It kills me that the guys I work with don’t have the same problem!

What a relief that I’m not the only one who does this. I’m 34, and while I finally found a great boyfriend with whom I am discussing marriage, I’m feeling more ready than ever to get to the baby part. I NEVER thought that would happen, but suddenly there’s this pressure to have a healthy, IVF-free pregnancy so while I do want to get married before I have kids, I’ll prob. be more into a small, quick wedding rather than the big fiesta I once imagined for myself. And I do feel better when I think about all the friends and co-workers who’ve given birth to healthy babies at 36, 38, 40, 42… I try and tell myself that things happen when they happen and if you want them badly enough, they probably will, even if it’s later than you once imagined.

I do this too only now I feel I might be the only one out there who doesn’t want to have a baby. EVER. My boyfriend says he doesn’t either but I just know he’ll be the one to change his mind when we get married.

My maternal clock never developed. Think they’ll have medically discovered a way for a male to carry a baby this time next year?

Liz– I’m not that hot on having a baby, either. I’m open to it, though– if the right circumstances develop. I’m also OK with never having children, adopting, or becoming a great step-mom– I’m happy with what life’s provided so far, so I’m not going to drive myself crazy with what may (or may not) happen.

Wow, I thought I was the only one who did the adding-up-the-years thing. I feel so much better now. I also recently made the decision to have a kid on my own in a couple of years (if the dating thing’s not working out). That took some of the pressure off.

While your biological clocks may continue to tick, remember that a child doesn’t have to grow under your heart to feel the love within it.

Adoption can happen at any age, and I can tell you as an adoptee that there’s no better mother than mine- and she was 36 when she got me, 39 when she got my lil sis.

Amazing how we have timetables for when things should happen to us:
I should have finished college at 24, been teaching for seven years now, already been married and had at least one kidlet. However–I had to put off school, just went back this fall to become a teacher (less than a year to go!), been in love with the same guy for eternity but we’re not yet married, no kids–just dogs. Sometimes our timeline takes a jog in another direction… yet society doesn’t care–they still want to hold us to the original one that was approved somewhere in the past… Bah!

This is really rough. What makes it harder is that I’ve met guys who say things like, “Ha ha, you women were so picky and now you’re suffering because of it.” I am *Not* too picky! I’ve dated nice guys and been rejected, I’ve tried my best, etc. I’ll have a kid alone before I marry a guy who’s a jerk just to have a kid. And I don’t regret turning down advances from jerks!

Wow. I wasn’t expecting such wonderful responses. I’m so glad to know I’m not alone. And my readers rock.

I used to do this all the time. Always. But now at 38, I’m married. . .tick, tick, tick.

It doesn’t stop after you’re married.

Because as long as we have biological clocks and no babies, we’ll always be playing the age game.

Wow. I’m so relieved to discover one way that I do *not* torture myself. I am 37 and I still think I wanna have a baby. But I don’t have a partner. I think less about projecting forward about that these days since I’ve given myself permission to do it on my own when I’m ready. It’s really hard for me to imagine knowing within a year that I’d want to get married or have a baby with a particular someone. Not that it couldn’t happen….I’d love to have someone surprise me. (Btw, I found your blog via Lawgeek’s blog.)

I totally do the game thing every once-in-a-while. All the time hearing from my Best Friend (since 4th gr.) and other such concerned people that I need to settle down with someone, and start a family. I am one of the last in my circle, and am in no rush.

Ironically, 4 of my very dearest friends are all calling me (separately of course) to cry, vent, or just ask what I would do - b/c their marriages aren’t what they thought they were going to be. (Another strange coincidence, these people hardly know each other, and live all over the country - I am thinking it’s an epidemic) Hmmm… I don’t know what I would do. I’ve never been married. And at 28, with my friends crying on my shoulder, I wonder, is that something I really want to do? But then I realize, it’s pretty much out of my hands anyway. :0)

Jen, that is a very well-put and true sentiment — that whether you marry is pretty much out of your hands. As Melissa noted, she has been rejected by guys and has tried her best.

Clearly, many people want to be married and yet seem unable to make it happen. People do not have limitless options. Unlike many other endeavors that you can accomplish on your own with hard work, this seems to rely largely on dumb luck. I think there are plenty of things you can do to blow your chances of getting married, but many fewer things you can do to improve your chances.

lol…

i’m 32 (will be 33 on 4-4). anyway… i play this game all the time but add in that my daughter is 10. and that any future children will be… such & such younger or rather that i’ll be such & such older. geez louise. i’ll be 44 when daughter dearest is 22. do i really want to have one in hs/college and another 1 or 3 in elementary school/daycare???

yes, this is a tough subject. all of my friends have waited until now to start their families. and i’m worried about the boys she will bring home in the eerily not to distant future. while they’re worried about pre-school.

Playing that game too….to my own suprise it started somehow last summer without my permission….
I’ll be 28 soon …and the closer I get to the magical number 30 the more I shift from “total resistance against-own kids-I don’t have a mother gene” towards then and then I will have my degree and then I have so and so many years for establishing a career …and then I might squeeze in kids …or should I get pregnant earlier and become a free-lancer and so on…the age game sucks. A year ago I would have rather lost an arm before even thinking about these things…and now ? brrrr scared of myself..plus I got to know someone a month ago I could imagine being pregnant from….someone whom I very slooowly get to know …have not even seen him undressed…but can imagine a family with him ? For all you gals who do the age game …Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this, Thanks Hilary for this wonderful inspiring blog !!!

I guess I can’t really identify with all this since I’m a boy, but I thought I’d add my 2 cents in. I realize everyone is nervous because of the biological clock thing, and that’s a shame. But let me ask, what’s more important? — Having kids or finding a partner? Yeah, finding a partner to have kids with is great, but it seems like many of you are in a rush to have a partner just to have kids. That scares potential partners off.
Let’s say you do find Mister Right, settle down, have kids and all that jazz. Who’s going to raise said kids while you’re working to pay the bills? L.A.’s an expensive fucking city and requires a two-income household (at least). Are you really going to have time to spend with your child(ren)? I see so many babies out there being hauled around by their housekeepers. Why has this become acceptable? If you’re so worried about having kids, then take the time to raise them.

I think you should worry about finding someone you’re compatible with first. If he/she wants kids — mazel tov! But I don’t think you should need a child to fill fulfilled.

Please don’t flame me. This blog totally fascinates me and I appreciate getting the female p.o.v., but starting a family should be an organic thing, not a race. If you do find that special someone and are too old to have kids naturally then adopt. No shame in that.

jarebo!!!!! I applaud you. I think the SAME way you do and I’m a woman. 35, working on her PhD. But it goes both ways. I meet men and all they want to do is become fathers and they are PUSHING me to sign on up with them. And if I am not willing? Lord help me! I get INSULTED about how I’m almost past the age to have children and women my age are only good to have sex with anyway. Unreal! (These are Jewish men on Jdate.) I hate Jdate. haha

Jen, you are every real man’s fantasy. Most of my guy friends are in no rush to have kids, especially the ones who are married. Why does everyone feel the need to procreate? We are overpopulated and overworked. Is it to please parents? To feel complete? I don’t get it. Don’t get me wrong. I’ll probably want kids right now, but at 31 there’s so much I want to do and accomplish before I can dedicate my life to not fucking up my kids’.

Thanks Jarebo! Again, I completely agree with you about the not fucking up your kids’ lives bit. I know divorced people with kids. Joint custody is the funniest. The kids spend 1/2 time with each parent and are shuffled between homes. What happens if you forget a book at the other home and you have a test the next day?

But it’s sad because a lot of times the reason for divorce is that “well, I just got married to have kids..” Where’s the love? Was it ever really there? As a woman, it kind of makes me feel like an incubator. Anyway, check out my jdate profile if you like KickyCowgirl on jdate. Not to advertise myself!!! NO NO! but to show my views on the whole jewish dating weirdness. I only date Canadians anyway. Because I live in Toronto (not because I think we are better…tho…if you want to talk about that - that’s a whole other topic entirely!!) Kidding.

Jen, it would never work since you misspell my name, plus my girlfriend would kill me. Otherwise we’re a match made in heaven! But Canada, eh?

sorry about the spelling jerebo!! No no I was not trying to pick you up (knew I would be accused of that), but just that I posted some views on jdate about the whole finding soulmate thing…sarcasm really. But that’s okay, I’m sure you are a fab catch. But I am looking for someone whose age is in the mid to high 30s (I guess low 40s too) and Canadian :). Canadian is a must!!

OK I’ll bit why a Canadian? No one from the Lower 48 need apply? What about that lovely shul in Buffalo? Just a thought here. Cheers, ‘VJ’

Well, *my* math game goes a little differently.

I’m a 46 year old male.
All of my relationships have been with younger women.
I still want to get married.
I still want to have kids.
The math game *I* play has to do with ‘what’s the maximum age I could ‘consider’ in a partner, given that I want to father children?’
So with societal mores being what they are, I can only go ’so low’, and with biological realities, I can only go ’so high’.
No, it’s not the same game.
And no, it’s not fair that the ‘biological clock’ is of a different sort per gender.
But that’s also Life.

P.S. Jerebo, I’d settle for finding ‘the one’. I met one of my limited stock a few years ago, but my boundless love and desire got its act kicked by her indifference.
P.P.S. Jen: I wave to you from across Taranna.

i do that too. but instead of thinking marriage age + 1 or 2 yrs =birthing children age, i keep thinking….marriage age + 1 to 5 years = surrogate mother will give birth to my children age. lol. i don’t really fret over the children thing. i don’t have a need to give birth. i’ll either adopt kids if i am at a certain age and the right man hasn’t come along or i’ll pay someone for surrogacy. sorry if that is coming off selfish sounding.

All. The Freaking. Time.

Hmmm actually for whatever reason I stopped doing that a few years ago. AM 37 now, maybe it just got too depressing. Now its “If I am not married, etc by 42, I am adopting.”

How sad. And yet, Not.

Don’t get depressed soon.It is a good idea to go for adopting.Rare people does it with good interest towards kids.

Why not have a kid from a sperm bank? I leave this option for myself…

OK–here’s a reverse spin on this. I had my first boyfriend at 14, dated a few boys in 9th and 10th grade, had a steady boyfriend in 11th and 12th grade, married him at 18!! after graduation (no, NOT pregnant just young and in love and STUPID!!), graduated from college at 21 (as married student, went during summers), dh graduated from college at 26, my early career from 21 to 25, fertility issues due to being on pill–took a year to get pregnant–give birth to first child at 26, second child at 27, SAHM from 26 to now, just turned 40 and will receive Masters Degree in May–kids are 12 and 14.

NOW–here’s what I count: first child graduates when I’m 44, second when I’m 46–hell, I’ll only be in my mid 40s when I am FINALLY free to do whatever the hell I want to do!!! Friends having babies at my age–OMG, not me!! Starting over now–no way!! Motherhood is great, but 20 years is a good span—NOT 40! I enjoyed it, but it is almost over and now I’m finally going to do all of those things I never did when I was young!! I cannot imagine starting again, like some women I know who have teens AND a baby or toddler–they made the 20 year span stretch to 40 or more! When will THEY ever get “me time”?

So enjoy the “me time” while you can–when it is gone, it is gone for a long time. Once you have kids, everything is about them and you get put on the back burner for a long time. I didn’t mind it a bit, but now that they are on their way out the door in a few years, I am finally “finding myself.” It is so exciting!! Now I think, heck, if I live til at least 90 like my grandmother (90 and still around), I have 50 more years to live my life free and easy!! I’m 40, so 50 years or more–heck, that’s a whole lifetime!!!!

So reassuring to see that I’m not the only one who thinks this in the silence of the night…yet so unnerving at the same time. I’m trying to believe it’s worth waiting for ‘the one’ though.

Yes. OMG! All the time. Im not married, but I even have a kid and I do this.

Whenever I feel the biological magnet pulling me toward motherhood, I take a trip to WalMart. Screaming kids with snotty noses, dirty diapers leaving noxious vapor trails on each aisle, shrill voices bellowing, “Mommy, I want!” “Mommy, buy me!” “Mommy, mommy, mommy.” Notice they’re never screeching daddy daddy daddy.

Last time I think I felt my falopian tubes tying themselves in a knot, and I saved $3 on cat litter.

Just curious, but do you only date Jewish men?
And I play that game all the time. I got married last October, and now we’re trying to get pregnant. So I’ll be 32 in April and if we’re lucky enough to get pregnant this year, maybe I won’t be a senior citizen when my kid graduates college. Plus, I want more than 1 so talk about pressure…

I just stumbled across your blog today. I love the comments from mom, what a trip! I used to play that game ALL the time when I was single. I finally met *the one* at age 34, then marriage, baby, and all the great stuff came at ridiculous lightning speed. It has turned me into (mostly) a believer that everything will happen when it’s supposed to happen…